I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
different settings?

Please help.

Thanks

Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Javier

Javier
Thu Nov 20 10:40:36 CST 2003

Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one of the
anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).

Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).

--
-Javier

<< SBS ROCKS !!! >>

"Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> different settings?
>
> Please help.
>
> Thanks



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Merv

Merv
Thu Nov 20 13:29:43 CST 2003

Hi Javier:

Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the ISP
create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any advantages/disadvantages to
this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to use this
method though (smarthost may be the only option).

--
Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
===================================
"Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in message
news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one of the
> anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
>
> Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
> specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
>
> --
> -Javier
>
> << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
>
> "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > different settings?
> >
> > Please help.
> >
> > Thanks
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Javier

Javier
Thu Nov 20 13:57:15 CST 2003

Hi Merv,

I was "talking" about this with Chad on the SBS2k3 group yesterday...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=ut14%23NnrDHA.1184%40TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl

and he pointed me out to this article on how it works (and what is
required):
http://www.dnsstuff.com/info/revdns.htm
which looks great... but I don't think many businness-class ADSL/Cable ISPs
would do that, at least here (but I'm totally guessing).

Now... like I said in the that post I'm not sure how this stuff really
works, but according to Chad's experience one could get away with this rDNS
lookup thing (even with a dynamic IP) if you change the Exchange server name
to match the rDNS name.

I think the bottomline is that if you have a static IP and your ISP is
willing to do it... then: why not? I have good experiences using SmartHosts
and I feel confortable using them... so I don't worry about that too much.
The day I get a client where I cannot use a SmartHost, then I will start
worrying about it :-)

What do you think? Any idea on how exactly rDNS works for spam filtering?

--
-Javier

<< SBS ROCKS !!! >>

"Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
news:etoXRy5rDHA.536@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> Hi Javier:
>
> Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the ISP
> create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any advantages/disadvantages
to
> this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to use this
> method though (smarthost may be the only option).
>
> --
> Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> ===================================
> "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
message
> news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one of
the
> > anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
> >
> > Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
> > specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
> >
> > --
> > -Javier
> >
> > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> >
> > "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > > different settings?
> > >
> > > Please help.
> > >
> > > Thanks
> >
> >
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Merv

Merv
Thu Nov 20 17:16:29 CST 2003

This link gives a brief explanation of using reverse DNS as a spam filter.
I know that my ISP uses this conjunction with antispam software to filter
all incoming email (he claims to run 6 "spam" tests on each email).
Apparently rDNS is prone to false positives and, therefore, needs to be
considered only part of the total antispam process.

Reverse DNS
http://searchcio.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid19_gci917504,00.html

--
Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
===================================
"Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in message
news:#9Uo2M6rDHA.684@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi Merv,
>
> I was "talking" about this with Chad on the SBS2k3 group yesterday...
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=ut14%23NnrDHA.1184%40TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl
>
> and he pointed me out to this article on how it works (and what is
> required):
> http://www.dnsstuff.com/info/revdns.htm
> which looks great... but I don't think many businness-class ADSL/Cable
ISPs
> would do that, at least here (but I'm totally guessing).
>
> Now... like I said in the that post I'm not sure how this stuff really
> works, but according to Chad's experience one could get away with this
rDNS
> lookup thing (even with a dynamic IP) if you change the Exchange server
name
> to match the rDNS name.
>
> I think the bottomline is that if you have a static IP and your ISP is
> willing to do it... then: why not? I have good experiences using
SmartHosts
> and I feel confortable using them... so I don't worry about that too much.
> The day I get a client where I cannot use a SmartHost, then I will start
> worrying about it :-)
>
> What do you think? Any idea on how exactly rDNS works for spam filtering?
>
> --
> -Javier
>
> << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
>
> "Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
> news:etoXRy5rDHA.536@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> > Hi Javier:
> >
> > Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the ISP
> > create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any
advantages/disadvantages
> to
> > this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to use
this
> > method though (smarthost may be the only option).
> >
> > --
> > Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> > ===================================
> > "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
> message
> > news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > > Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one of
> the
> > > anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
> > >
> > > Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
> > > specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
> > >
> > > --
> > > -Javier
> > >
> > > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> > >
> > > "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > > news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > > > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > > > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > > > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > > > different settings?
> > > >
> > > > Please help.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Merv

Merv
Thu Nov 20 17:17:25 CST 2003

BTW, the link I mentioned leads to Chad's article. :-)

--
Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
===================================
"Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in message
news:#9Uo2M6rDHA.684@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi Merv,
>
> I was "talking" about this with Chad on the SBS2k3 group yesterday...
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=ut14%23NnrDHA.1184%40TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl
>
> and he pointed me out to this article on how it works (and what is
> required):
> http://www.dnsstuff.com/info/revdns.htm
> which looks great... but I don't think many businness-class ADSL/Cable
ISPs
> would do that, at least here (but I'm totally guessing).
>
> Now... like I said in the that post I'm not sure how this stuff really
> works, but according to Chad's experience one could get away with this
rDNS
> lookup thing (even with a dynamic IP) if you change the Exchange server
name
> to match the rDNS name.
>
> I think the bottomline is that if you have a static IP and your ISP is
> willing to do it... then: why not? I have good experiences using
SmartHosts
> and I feel confortable using them... so I don't worry about that too much.
> The day I get a client where I cannot use a SmartHost, then I will start
> worrying about it :-)
>
> What do you think? Any idea on how exactly rDNS works for spam filtering?
>
> --
> -Javier
>
> << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
>
> "Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
> news:etoXRy5rDHA.536@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> > Hi Javier:
> >
> > Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the ISP
> > create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any
advantages/disadvantages
> to
> > this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to use
this
> > method though (smarthost may be the only option).
> >
> > --
> > Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> > ===================================
> > "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
> message
> > news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > > Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one of
> the
> > > anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
> > >
> > > Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
> > > specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
> > >
> > > --
> > > -Javier
> > >
> > > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> > >
> > > "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > > news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > > > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > > > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > > > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > > > different settings?
> > > >
> > > > Please help.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Javier

Javier
Thu Nov 20 20:45:49 CST 2003

Thanks for the link... Merv!!!

However, on the article says: "If no valid name is found to match the IP
address, the server blocks that message". But, how one defines a "valid
name"? I guess... this could be different from one spam filter to another.

In any event, if you come across something that explains what exactly is
checked... let me know (I would be very interesed in learning about it).

--
-Javier

<< SBS ROCKS !!! >>

"Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
news:eqq8fx7rDHA.1088@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> BTW, the link I mentioned leads to Chad's article. :-)
>
> --
> Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> ===================================
> "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
message
> news:#9Uo2M6rDHA.684@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > Hi Merv,
> >
> > I was "talking" about this with Chad on the SBS2k3 group yesterday...
> >
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=ut14%23NnrDHA.1184%40TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl
> >
> > and he pointed me out to this article on how it works (and what is
> > required):
> > http://www.dnsstuff.com/info/revdns.htm
> > which looks great... but I don't think many businness-class ADSL/Cable
> ISPs
> > would do that, at least here (but I'm totally guessing).
> >
> > Now... like I said in the that post I'm not sure how this stuff really
> > works, but according to Chad's experience one could get away with this
> rDNS
> > lookup thing (even with a dynamic IP) if you change the Exchange server
> name
> > to match the rDNS name.
> >
> > I think the bottomline is that if you have a static IP and your ISP is
> > willing to do it... then: why not? I have good experiences using
> SmartHosts
> > and I feel confortable using them... so I don't worry about that too
much.
> > The day I get a client where I cannot use a SmartHost, then I will start
> > worrying about it :-)
> >
> > What do you think? Any idea on how exactly rDNS works for spam
filtering?
> >
> > --
> > -Javier
> >
> > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> >
> > "Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
> > news:etoXRy5rDHA.536@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> > > Hi Javier:
> > >
> > > Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the
ISP
> > > create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any
> advantages/disadvantages
> > to
> > > this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to use
> this
> > > method though (smarthost may be the only option).
> > >
> > > --
> > > Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> > > ===================================
> > > "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
> > message
> > > news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > > > Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably one
of
> > the
> > > > anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
> > > >
> > > > Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create a
> > > > specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > -Javier
> > > >
> > > > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> > > >
> > > > "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > > > > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > > > > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > > > > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > > > > different settings?
> > > > >
> > > > > Please help.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Merv

Merv
Thu Nov 20 22:31:16 CST 2003

Javier:

http://www.dnsstuff.com/

Enter 4.2.2.1 (Verizon DNS server) in the Reverse DNS Lookup section. This
gives an explanation of how reverse DNS is determined. It's based on
searching the root servers for PTR records.

Description of DNS Reverse Lookups
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=164213

How does DNS work
http://cr.yp.to/djbdns/intro-dns.html

http://www.zonecut.net/dnsgeo/index.html

Are we on the right track here?

--
Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
===================================
"Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in message
news:u3sASm9rDHA.2364@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Thanks for the link... Merv!!!
>
> However, on the article says: "If no valid name is found to match the IP
> address, the server blocks that message". But, how one defines a "valid
> name"? I guess... this could be different from one spam filter to another.
>
> In any event, if you come across something that explains what exactly is
> checked... let me know (I would be very interesed in learning about it).
>
> --
> -Javier
>
> << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
>
> "Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
> news:eqq8fx7rDHA.1088@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> > BTW, the link I mentioned leads to Chad's article. :-)
> >
> > --
> > Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> > ===================================
> > "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
> message
> > news:#9Uo2M6rDHA.684@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > > Hi Merv,
> > >
> > > I was "talking" about this with Chad on the SBS2k3 group yesterday...
> > >
> >
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=ut14%23NnrDHA.1184%40TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl
> > >
> > > and he pointed me out to this article on how it works (and what is
> > > required):
> > > http://www.dnsstuff.com/info/revdns.htm
> > > which looks great... but I don't think many businness-class ADSL/Cable
> > ISPs
> > > would do that, at least here (but I'm totally guessing).
> > >
> > > Now... like I said in the that post I'm not sure how this stuff really
> > > works, but according to Chad's experience one could get away with this
> > rDNS
> > > lookup thing (even with a dynamic IP) if you change the Exchange
server
> > name
> > > to match the rDNS name.
> > >
> > > I think the bottomline is that if you have a static IP and your ISP is
> > > willing to do it... then: why not? I have good experiences using
> > SmartHosts
> > > and I feel confortable using them... so I don't worry about that too
> much.
> > > The day I get a client where I cannot use a SmartHost, then I will
start
> > > worrying about it :-)
> > >
> > > What do you think? Any idea on how exactly rDNS works for spam
> filtering?
> > >
> > > --
> > > -Javier
> > >
> > > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> > >
> > > "Merv Porter [SBS-MVP]" <mwport@hotmail.com_no_spam> wrote in message
> > > news:etoXRy5rDHA.536@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> > > > Hi Javier:
> > > >
> > > > Question... For those with Static Public IPs, what about having the
> ISP
> > > > create a PTR record for reverse DNS lookup? Any
> > advantages/disadvantages
> > > to
> > > > this? Those using Dynamic IPs from their ISP wouldn't be able to
use
> > this
> > > > method though (smarthost may be the only option).
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
> > > > ===================================
> > > > "Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > news:eGXI9e4rDHA.2432@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > > > > Are you using DNS to deliver your mail? If, so this is probably
one
> of
> > > the
> > > > > anti-spam measures of AOL (reverse DNS lookup).
> > > > >
> > > > > Switch to Smarthost (relay using your ISP SMTP server's) or create
a
> > > > > specific smarthost just for AOL (I would recommend the former).
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > -Javier
> > > > >
> > > > > << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
> > > > >
> > > > > "Weasel71" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > > > > news:079f01c3af84$841f6620$3101280a@phx.gbl...
> > > > > > I am running a new SBS 2003 with Exchange 2003. All email
> > > > > > for AOL gets caught in an SMTP queue and will not be
> > > > > > delivered. Do a need an additional SMTP connector with
> > > > > > different settings?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Please help.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Javier

Javier
Fri Nov 21 08:54:39 CST 2003

> Are we on the right track here?

Sorry... I was too vague in my description of what I want to know. I
understand how rDNS works and what is required... I just don't understand
how it is applied when it is used for Spam control. Let me explain... this
is what I thought happened:

-You send and email to jonhdoe@aol.com
-Exchange looks for the MX record using DNS
-Exchange establishes a connection to the AOL mail server
-The AOL mail servers checks the header of the message for the sender's
address (ie. javier@example.com).
-Then the AOL mail server perform a rDNS lookup on the IP address of the
server and verify that it matches with example.com.

Now... this is obviously wrong because when one uses a smarthost you don't
necessarily use your ISP domain and that works well with the rDNS test.

From what I understood about Chad's post is that the server verifies if the
rDNS lookup matches your Exchange server name... and this would be ok. But,
since anyone can put whatever they want as their Exchange server name then I
can't understand how this could be used for spam control (a spammer would
know more about SMTP than a normal guy).

I'm sorry for the long explanation.... but, do you see what I'm trying to
learn about?

--
-Javier

<< SBS ROCKS !!! >>



Re: SmallBusiness SMTP connector for AOL .com by Merv

Merv
Fri Nov 21 13:10:02 CST 2003

I'm probably not the one to be answering these questions. My feeble (and
maybe wrong) understanding is that when using a smarthost, all your mail is
relayed first to the smarthost; none is sent directly by your SBS Exchange
server to the recipient's email server. The smarthost server then relays
the message to one of it's official MX (mail exchange) servers. At that
point your ISP is essentially sending your mail for you. It adds it's own
information to the message header. It appears to the receiving SMTP server
that the message originated from your ISP's domain. When the receiving SMTP
server does a reverse DNS lookup, it looks for the PTR record for your ISP's
MX server and not your own (SBS) Exchange server, which may or may not have
an established PTR record of it's own.

I found this explanation of sending email in a past thread...
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=smarthost+aol&start=20&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=rekajvkv0gs9rvsnce91rvp8qbcas77hso%404ax.com&rnum=27
--------------------------------------------------
A simplified explanation of the mechanisms of e-mail, from MOST
internet users' perspective:

-- User writes mail in mail tool.
-- User hits "send" button.
-- Mail tool makes contact with a SMTP server (usually the
provider's server; sometimes third party) called a "smarthost" to
transmit the message to the SMTP server.
-- SMTP smarthost relays the message to its domain's official
mail exchanger ("MX") if it's not a MX itself; if it is a MX itself,
it goes to the next step.
-- The sender's domain's official MX makes contact with the
receipient's domain's official MX, and they exchange mail.
-- The receipient's domain's MX routes the mail internally to
whatever mail mechanism is set up for that ISP, which then delivers it
to the receipient.
---------------------------------------------------

--
Merv Porter [SBS MVP]
===================================
"Javier Gomez" <javier_gomez@remove.this.bit.engineer.com> wrote in message
news:eAvWVIEsDHA.1760@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > Are we on the right track here?
>
> Sorry... I was too vague in my description of what I want to know. I
> understand how rDNS works and what is required... I just don't understand
> how it is applied when it is used for Spam control. Let me explain... this
> is what I thought happened:
>
> -You send and email to jonhdoe@aol.com
> -Exchange looks for the MX record using DNS
> -Exchange establishes a connection to the AOL mail server
> -The AOL mail servers checks the header of the message for the sender's
> address (ie. javier@example.com).
> -Then the AOL mail server perform a rDNS lookup on the IP address of the
> server and verify that it matches with example.com.
>
> Now... this is obviously wrong because when one uses a smarthost you don't
> necessarily use your ISP domain and that works well with the rDNS test.
>
> From what I understood about Chad's post is that the server verifies if
the
> rDNS lookup matches your Exchange server name... and this would be ok.
But,
> since anyone can put whatever they want as their Exchange server name then
I
> can't understand how this could be used for spam control (a spammer would
> know more about SMTP than a normal guy).
>
> I'm sorry for the long explanation.... but, do you see what I'm trying to
> learn about?
>
> --
> -Javier
>
> << SBS ROCKS !!! >>
>
>