passed my mcp and

And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering with
the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at so far, do
companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to carry
on? I have taken a little time off work to do the course and am wondering
how I am doing basically.
In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP is
any good to have, as it stands now.
Thanks for any info

CrushesBeforeItCuts
Wed Feb 16 08:24:11 CST 2005

Spadger wrote:
> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
> so far, do companies take people on who are currently studying and
> allow them to carry on? I have taken a little time off work to do
> the course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.
> Thanks for any info


so you live in England? Do they have Burger King in England? if so I would
recommend
www.bkcareers.com
--
aka
Doom MCNGP #38
"What do you mean I don't support the system?
I go to court when I have to"

Spadger
Wed Feb 16 08:53:59 CST 2005

yo so funny I'm fallin off me chair here!!!
Know your wasted in here though!

"CrushesBeforeItCuts" <doom_mcngp38@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:8--dnW8UUN4Wyo7fRVn-uA@prairiewave.com...
> Spadger wrote:
>> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
>> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
>> so far, do companies take people on who are currently studying and
>> allow them to carry on? I have taken a little time off work to do
>> the course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
>> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
>> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.
>> Thanks for any info
>
>
> so you live in England? Do they have Burger King in England? if so I would
> recommend
> www.bkcareers.com
> --
> aka
> Doom MCNGP #38
> "What do you mean I don't support the system?
> I go to court when I have to"
>
>

CrushesBeforeItCuts
Wed Feb 16 09:24:03 CST 2005

Spadger wrote:
> yo so funny
Thank you very much

I'm fallin off me chair here!!!
Careful you don't hurt yourself

> Know your wasted in here though!
sorry I didn't understand this comment. I don't know how the job market is
in England but I'm guessing it's similar to the US what with outsourcing to
India and all I think you'll have a hard time finding an entry level job
with an MCP for the 70-270. There's people who can't find work with an MCSE.
Anyway, good luck and if all else fails get used to saying "You want fries
with that"

>
> "CrushesBeforeItCuts" <doom_mcngp38@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:8--dnW8UUN4Wyo7fRVn-uA@prairiewave.com...
>> Spadger wrote:
>>> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
>>> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
>>> so far, do companies take people on who are currently studying and
>>> allow them to carry on? I have taken a little time off work to do
>>> the course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
>>> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
>>> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.
>>> Thanks for any info
>>
>>
>> so you live in England? Do they have Burger King in England? if so I
>> would recommend
>> www.bkcareers.com
>> --
>> aka
>> Doom MCNGP #38
>> "What do you mean I don't support the system?
>> I go to court when I have to"

JaR
Wed Feb 16 10:12:48 CST 2005

In microsoft.public.cert.exam.mcse, Spadger climbed on a soapbox &
opined:

> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
> so far, do companies take people on who are currently studying and
> allow them to carry on? I have taken a little time off work to do the
> course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.
> Thanks for any info
>
>

You are going about the whole thing bass-ackward. Find out what they want
first, then go about getting it. I think you are going to find that the
entry-level jobs out there are few and far between, and pay next to
nothing.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but WTF, it's a nice day for it, innit?

--
JaR
Thug 10110
Click on MCNGP.com and be a burger flipper!

KMA
Wed Feb 16 10:40:48 CST 2005

The problem with the Microsoft quals is that they're not really industry
recognised. So unless your CV ends up on someones desk who'se done the exam
herself, "MCP" means nothing. Therefore it 's not remotely possible to guage
your "added value" by having it.

>>do
> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to
carry
> on?

yes, indeed! My company positively encourages it by locking the doors and
switching off the office lights after I go home. They won't pay for the
exams though.

>In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP is
> any good to have, as it stands now.

Companies, in England, and elsewhere always require people who can complete
projects, including the nitty details and boring bits that every non-trivial
project entails. If you can show that you can do this then you're heads and
shoulders above the rest.

My advice would be to start a project using whatever exam 12-123 revolves
around. Write yourself a design paper, a spec, a test plan etc and try to
follow it through, without the temptation to skip bits because "I'm the only
one using it". Then publish this material on the internet, or at least make
it available for potential employers. That way, if a stray HR chappie fires
up his browser he can see straight away the quality of your work and it
prooves there and then that you're not just a "paper tiger". They might even
think "hey, if this is the meticulous standard this guy works to in his
spare time, imagine what he'll do if we pay him". Or if you do it badly
they'll think "aaaarrrggghh". Either way, you'll learn much, including
whether you really want to work in software.

You'll get some pretty sarcastic answers on this nesgroup from people who
were lucky in that they were able to join companies when it was easy to get
into IT through formalised and well-trodden channels. These traditional
entry levels have dried up a bit, but are still there. Fortunately there are
other methods opening up to get a job. Take heart, most of the knockers on
this board would be unemployed if they were born 10 years later.

"Spadger" <spadger42@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:VhIQd.62388$68.57102@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering with
> the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at so far, do
> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to
carry
> on? I have taken a little time off work to do the course and am wondering
> how I am doing basically.
> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP
is
> any good to have, as it stands now.
> Thanks for any info
>
>

CrushesBeforeItCuts
Wed Feb 16 10:51:37 CST 2005

> Take heart, most of the knockers on this board would be unemployed if
> they were born 10 years later.


Yup. I been in IT since 2001. Things were really booming then weren't they.
Oh wait that was after the dot bomb but I still managed to find work. Don't
presume what you know nothing about.
--
aka
Doom MCNGP #38
"What do you mean I don't support the system?
I go to court when I have to"

Briscobar
Wed Feb 16 11:07:38 CST 2005

In news:cuvsu3$qq4$1@atlas.ip-plus.net,
KMA <KMA@dontthinkso.chum> rambled:
>
> Take heart, most of the knockers on this board would be unemployed if
> they were born 10 years later.

I've been in IT for 2 years. Beginning of 2003, I started. I'm only 23. Were
I born 10 years later, I'd be 13, and unable to legally work. Your other
points are pretty much valid, though.

--

KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26

Briscobar AT gmail DOT com

www.mcngp.com's milkshake brings all the boys to the yard.

Spadger
Wed Feb 16 11:21:56 CST 2005

Cheers KMA, I have a well paid job, but hate it and am trying in my time to
learn something I have always enjoyed, your advice is noted and when I get
to that stage I will take the plunge and impress the hell out of myself.


"KMA" <KMA@dontthinkso.chum> wrote in message
news:cuvsu3$qq4$1@atlas.ip-plus.net...
> The problem with the Microsoft quals is that they're not really industry
> recognised. So unless your CV ends up on someones desk who'se done the
> exam
> herself, "MCP" means nothing. Therefore it 's not remotely possible to
> guage
> your "added value" by having it.
>
>>>do
>> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to
> carry
>> on?
>
> yes, indeed! My company positively encourages it by locking the doors and
> switching off the office lights after I go home. They won't pay for the
> exams though.
>
>>In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP
>>is
>> any good to have, as it stands now.
>
> Companies, in England, and elsewhere always require people who can
> complete
> projects, including the nitty details and boring bits that every
> non-trivial
> project entails. If you can show that you can do this then you're heads
> and
> shoulders above the rest.
>
> My advice would be to start a project using whatever exam 12-123 revolves
> around. Write yourself a design paper, a spec, a test plan etc and try to
> follow it through, without the temptation to skip bits because "I'm the
> only
> one using it". Then publish this material on the internet, or at least
> make
> it available for potential employers. That way, if a stray HR chappie
> fires
> up his browser he can see straight away the quality of your work and it
> prooves there and then that you're not just a "paper tiger". They might
> even
> think "hey, if this is the meticulous standard this guy works to in his
> spare time, imagine what he'll do if we pay him". Or if you do it badly
> they'll think "aaaarrrggghh". Either way, you'll learn much, including
> whether you really want to work in software.
>
> You'll get some pretty sarcastic answers on this nesgroup from people who
> were lucky in that they were able to join companies when it was easy to
> get
> into IT through formalised and well-trodden channels. These traditional
> entry levels have dried up a bit, but are still there. Fortunately there
> are
> other methods opening up to get a job. Take heart, most of the knockers on
> this board would be unemployed if they were born 10 years later.
>
> "Spadger" <spadger42@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:VhIQd.62388$68.57102@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering with
>> the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at so far,
>> do
>> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to
> carry
>> on? I have taken a little time off work to do the course and am
>> wondering
>> how I am doing basically.
>> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP
> is
>> any good to have, as it stands now.
>> Thanks for any info
>>
>>
>
>

Spadger
Wed Feb 16 11:24:09 CST 2005

No worries about the mickey takers, in my own NG we get them all the time,
it's a bit of banter, I give as well as I take.
Appreciater the useful posts even crush came through in the end.
: )


"Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> wrote in message
news:O4AtwnEFFHA.4072@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> In news:cuvsu3$qq4$1@atlas.ip-plus.net,
> KMA <KMA@dontthinkso.chum> rambled:
>>
>> Take heart, most of the knockers on this board would be unemployed if
>> they were born 10 years later.
>
> I've been in IT for 2 years. Beginning of 2003, I started. I'm only 23.
> Were
> I born 10 years later, I'd be 13, and unable to legally work. Your other
> points are pretty much valid, though.
>
> --
>
> KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26
>
> Briscobar AT gmail DOT com
>
> www.mcngp.com's milkshake brings all the boys to the yard.
>
>

kpg
Wed Feb 16 11:30:39 CST 2005

"CrushesBeforeItCuts" <doom_mcngp38@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:I-6dneGExpWE547fRVn-sA@prairiewave.com...
># (2/16/2005 11:26:51 AM) #
>> Take heart, most of the knockers on this board would be unemployed if
>> they were born 10 years later.
>
>
> Yup. <snip>
>

No CBIC. I think he was insulting your knockers.

Neil
Wed Feb 16 15:24:32 CST 2005

good for you, congrats

> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
> so far,

probably not much

> do companies take people on who are currently studying and
> allow them to carry on?

sometimes

> I have taken a little time off work to do the
> course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.

ask your current of potential employer what they think, if they have a
buig Linux install or Solaris or whatever, the MCSE might not be of much
value. But you do get that nice shiny lapel pin...

> Thanks for any info
>
>

you're welcome

--
Neil MCNGP #30

- 'Bother,' said Pooh as the trip-wire clicked.

Neil
Wed Feb 16 15:25:30 CST 2005

did you hear "kpg" <ipost@thereforeiam.com> say in news:eJn590EFFHA.1296
@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl:

> No CBIC. I think he was insulting your knockers.
>

he has man-boobz? eeeewwwwww.....

--
Neil MCNGP #30

- Enough research will tend to support any theory.

Neil
Wed Feb 16 15:26:21 CST 2005

did you hear "Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> say in
news:O4AtwnEFFHA.4072@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl:

> I've been in IT for 2 years. Beginning of 2003, I started. I'm only
> 23. Were I born 10 years later, I'd be 13, and unable to legally work.

so you would be nerd32768 then...

--
Neil MCNGP #30

- Anything you say will be misquoted & used against you.

Neil
Wed Feb 16 15:30:16 CST 2005

did you hear "KMA" <KMA@dontthinkso.chum> say in news:cuvsu3$qq4$1
@atlas.ip-plus.net:

> most of the knockers on
> this board would be unemployed if they were born 10 years later.
>

hey, don't take it out on me just becuase I am old and rediculously well
paid.

--
Neil MCNGP #30

- I cna ytpe 300 wrods pre mniuet!

Briscobar
Wed Feb 16 15:30:04 CST 2005

In news:ZkLQd.62448$68.56068@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk,
Spadger <spadger42@blueyonder.co.uk> rambled:
> No worries about the mickey takers, in my own NG we get them all the
> time, it's a bit of banter, I give as well as I take.
> Appreciater the useful posts even crush came through in the end.
>: )

Excuse me, but WTF?

--

KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26

Briscobar AT gmail DOT com

nerd32768's mother told him to clean his room. Instead, he visited
www.mcngp.com.

Briscobar
Wed Feb 16 15:34:41 CST 2005

In news:Xns95FFA73A7666Fneilmcsegmailcom@207.46.248.16,
Neil <guess!!!@gmail.com> rambled:
> did you hear "Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> say in
> news:O4AtwnEFFHA.4072@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl:
>
>> I've been in IT for 2 years. Beginning of 2003, I started. I'm only
>> 23. Were I born 10 years later, I'd be 13, and unable to legally
>> work.
>
> so you would be nerd32768 then...

I know you are, but what am I?

--

KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26

Briscobar AT gmail DOT com

My psychiatrist recommends 10mg of Valium, a shot of Tequila, and
twice-daily viewings of the b00bz0rs forum on www.mcngp.com

Neil
Wed Feb 16 15:41:08 CST 2005

did you hear "Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> say in news:es4x#
8GFFHA.464@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl:

>> so you would be nerd32768 then...
>
> I know you are, but what am I?
>

juvenile... (now was that an answer or was I name calling back)

--
Neil MCNGP #30

- Diplomacy is saying "nice doggy" until you find a rock.

kpg
Wed Feb 16 15:49:13 CST 2005

--
> Neil MCNGP #30
>
> - I cna ytpe 300 wrods pre mniuet!

That easy for you to say.

BTW, I can type 450 words per minute when the
words don't matter and they don't spell anything.

watch...

jkfjksdh fhsd jkfh jkfhdsfjk fjkhdkjh sduewykndnb
kjef dsv d csd sdfsdfdfhjkh n d reui347 fdmsf ,mn
dsfjkhfkjs fdskhds kjlfdhfds kh

pretty good, huh?

P.S. Why doen't the 'Ignore All' button on my stupid
OE spell chacker actually ignore anything?

Briscobar
Wed Feb 16 15:50:26 CST 2005

In news:Xns95FFA9BBCDC71neilmcsegmailcom@207.46.248.16,
Neil <guess!!!@gmail.com> rambled:
> did you hear "Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> say in news:es4x#
> 8GFFHA.464@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl:
>
>>> so you would be nerd32768 then...
>>
>> I know you are, but what am I?
>>
>
> juvenile... (now was that an answer or was I name calling back)

I'm rubber, you're glue.

--

KB - MCNGP "silent thug" #26

Briscobar AT gmail DOT com

www.mcngp.com's milkshake brings all the boys to the yard.

Who
Wed Feb 16 16:26:56 CST 2005

Spadger wrote:
> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering with
> the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at so far, do
> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to carry
> on? I have taken a little time off work to do the course and am wondering
> how I am doing basically.
> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP is
> any good to have, as it stands now.
> Thanks for any info
>
>
The MCP alone will get you nowhere in England (or anywhere else for that
matter). You need to show you have experience in the field. Have you
thought about doing some voluntary work at schools, colleges, or
charities in whatever spare time you get? It's difficult if you're
working but if you're serious about working in I.T. you need experience.
At least you can put voluntary I.T. work on your C.V. and can get a
reference for any prospective employer. Also sign up with agencies to
try to get contracts because the more who know about you the better your
chance of getting a phonecall and take anything offered.

I was in your position about 2 years ago when I had 3 NT4 MCPs and 2
Win2K ones. I couldn't get work as I hadn't worked in I.T. before and
there are loads out of work with more qualifications and experience than
me. I was on agencies books and took any contract offered me (few and
far between). In 2003 I took a 6 week contract at my local NHS Trust
rolling out XP and during the 6 weeks I worked hard and my conract was
extended for 9 months in total. After that they offered me a full-time
position and now I do a mix of 2nd and 3rd line support. I was project
lead for the SMS 2003 rollout and I now administer 8 SMS servers amongst
other things.

Good luck ...

Spadger
Thu Feb 17 08:33:44 CST 2005

Thanks Halt, I guess my best option is my current employer, although I am
not sure if they have any vacancies in IT, still worth a try.


"Who Goes There" <wgt@home> wrote in message
news:4213c8b1$0$19161$cc9e4d1f@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
> Spadger wrote:
>> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering with
>> the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at so far,
>> do
>> companies take people on who are currently studying and allow them to
>> carry
>> on? I have taken a little time off work to do the course and am
>> wondering
>> how I am doing basically.
>> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the MCP
>> is
>> any good to have, as it stands now.
>> Thanks for any info
> The MCP alone will get you nowhere in England (or anywhere else for that
> matter). You need to show you have experience in the field. Have you
> thought about doing some voluntary work at schools, colleges, or charities
> in whatever spare time you get? It's difficult if you're working but if
> you're serious about working in I.T. you need experience. At least you can
> put voluntary I.T. work on your C.V. and can get a reference for any
> prospective employer. Also sign up with agencies to try to get contracts
> because the more who know about you the better your chance of getting a
> phonecall and take anything offered.
>
> I was in your position about 2 years ago when I had 3 NT4 MCPs and 2 Win2K
> ones. I couldn't get work as I hadn't worked in I.T. before and there are
> loads out of work with more qualifications and experience than me. I was
> on agencies books and took any contract offered me (few and far between).
> In 2003 I took a 6 week contract at my local NHS Trust rolling out XP and
> during the 6 weeks I worked hard and my conract was extended for 9 months
> in total. After that they offered me a full-time position and now I do a
> mix of 2nd and 3rd line support. I was project lead for the SMS 2003
> rollout and I now administer 8 SMS servers amongst other things.
>
> Good luck ...
>

Who
Thu Feb 17 10:31:13 CST 2005

Spadger wrote:
> Thanks Halt, I guess my best option is my current employer, although I am
> not sure if they have any vacancies in IT, still worth a try.

<g> @ Halt

Neil
Thu Feb 17 20:07:14 CST 2005

did you hear "Briscobar" <youcant@sendmespam.com> say in
news:eKklyFHFFHA.3840@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl:

> I'm rubber, you're glue.
>

you're a rubber? used or could you not get it up?

--
Neil MCNGP#30

- An unbreakable toy is useful for breaking other toys.

meanoldman
Thu Feb 24 11:31:45 CST 2005

Seriously, it's not worth much without experience behind it. The MCSE /
MCSA track was NEVER meant to get someone a job; it was meant for people who
already know what they're talking about it to have some sort of
documentation to that end. A+ certs are about the only ones worth while for
people trying to break into the field. They are easier to get and don't
make you look like some n00b that's trying to start at the top. I wouldn't
expect much of a job market for an MCSE / MCSA / MCP with no experience.
Sorry.


"Spadger" <spadger42@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:b8JQd.62400$68.21945@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> yo so funny I'm fallin off me chair here!!!
> Know your wasted in here though!
>
> "CrushesBeforeItCuts" <doom_mcngp38@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:8--dnW8UUN4Wyo7fRVn-uA@prairiewave.com...
>> Spadger wrote:
>>> And just starting the 70 290, on the way towards mcsa, and wondering
>>> with the 70 270 which is the MCP, what kinda wages are we looking at
>>> so far, do companies take people on who are currently studying and
>>> allow them to carry on? I have taken a little time off work to do
>>> the course and am wondering how I am doing basically.
>>> In England and never really looked at what companies need and if the
>>> MCP is any good to have, as it stands now.
>>> Thanks for any info
>>
>>
>> so you live in England? Do they have Burger King in England? if so I
>> would recommend
>> www.bkcareers.com
>> --
>> aka
>> Doom MCNGP #38
>> "What do you mean I don't support the system?
>> I go to court when I have to"
>>
>>
>
>