Murray
Tue Oct 25 12:43:03 CDT 2005
Investigate the use of the max-width style in your CSS. Unfortunately, IE<7
does not support this useful style, but I suspect that IE7 will.
--
Murray
============
"Nathan" <Nathan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:A2DAB028-5C73-443E-AF6F-62E257A750EA@microsoft.com...
> Right, I was afraid it would come down to this.
> I was expecting to code in what I would consider a standard way following
> the W3C recommendations and ease for accessibility.
>
> I can rid myself of the explicit width, but then the div takes up the
> entire
> width of the page and that is what I wanted to avoid, a potential for
> significant void in high resolution displays. Though like I said in the
> last
> reply, I'll give the left/right margin's a '%' (or the 3 col approach)
> which
> leaves the page center and also removes the explicit width. It's at that
> point I'll find out what happens with the wider table (or in the example,
> the
> nowrap text).
>
> Thanks for your help m'man.
> Nathan
>
> "Murray" wrote:
>
>> The individual writing that article is a well-known crank. His arguments
>> are naive to the point of being humerous. But - they are his opinion.
>> If
>> you look hard enough you can find anything on the web, and this link
>> proves
>> it.
>>
>> Notwithstanding this, however, if a table works best for a given
>> requirement, then by all means use it. See - it's not a binary decision
>> in
>> my opinion, it's a pragmatic one. One place where tables work really
>> well
>> is in presenting tabular data, which is where the W3C focuses its
>> recommendation to use them only for that purpose. Another place is in
>> building multi-column layouts, which the W3C ignores, more or less. Do
>> not
>> feel that you are going to be arrested or have your computer taken away
>> if
>> you use tables for that purpose. You can just use CSS for other aspects
>> of
>> the page.
>>
>> As for your example, I think it's unrealistic - the results are clearly
>> caused by the use of the nowrap tag combined with the explicit width on
>> the
>> parent div. Try removing that explicit width and you'll see the sibling
>> fill the div's width.
>>
>> --
>> Murray
>> ============
>>
>> "Nathan" <Nathan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:53420667-FD27-46BD-AE5E-8C6C7C4E0E64@microsoft.com...
>> > Ahh Murray, everyone has a right to their own opinion as long as it is
>> > validated with reason.
>> > I looked a little more online and found a harsh link that so very much
>> > opposed the use of CSS-P which frustrated me and almost got me to
>> > switch
>> > back
>> > to Table layout. The site had references out the yin-yang and even a
>> > somewhat
>> > recent link that I had read before about IE7 still not going to end up
>> > being
>> > fully CSS-compliant.
>> >
http://www.decloak.com/Dev/CSSTables/CSS_Tables_01.aspx
>> >
>> > I followed through with reading the link and some references found
>> > inside
>> > of
>> > the site Kevin mentioned. One point that hit me was about the 'em' used
>> > for
>> > width and I gave that a go. It didn't help, but my demo below uses it
>> > and
>> > hopefully it will give you some insight into my problem.
>> > I know you said the DIV will expand when the width is not set and I
>> > assumed
>> > that was relating to the children.
>> > As I mentioned in my reply to Kevin, I believe it to be best not to
>> > have
>> > the
>> > entire width of the page filled if possible.
>> > <div style="background-color: darkblue; width: 40em;">
>> > <div style="background-color: Blue;">
>> > something
>> > </div>
>> > <div style="background-color: lightblue; white-space:
>> > nowrap;">
>> > Assume this test is a table and is a little too large
>> > for
>> > the container making it expand. You'll notice the sibling does not fill
>> > it's
>> > stretched parent container.
>> > </div>
>> > </div>
>> >
>> > I hope there is something I'm missing that you are able to see that
>> > will
>> > solve my problem. My only other thought that I was avoiding, believing
>> > it
>> > to
>> > be a hack, would be to use a 3 col (or left and right margin) liquid
>> > approach
>> > using '%'.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Nathan
>> >
>> > "Murray" wrote:
>> >
>> >> > Well, dealing I've done, but as it has been claimed that CSS can do
>> >> > anything
>> >> > Tables can, I think I have to beg to differ and hope someone can
>> >> > prove
>> >> > me
>> >> > wrong. :)
>> >>
>> >> If you are reading people that are saying that, then stop reading
>> >> them.
>> >>
>> >> > Let's say that table expands to 900px for whatever reason. I would
>> >> > like
>> >> > the
>> >> > container to expand (which it does), but so too the other children
>> >> > DIVs
>> >> > (which don't). It was my expectation that all children DIVs without
>> >> > any
>> >> > specified CSS tags (such as float or width...) would fill the
>> >> > container
>> >> > wide-ways.
>> >>
>> >> They will if they do not have an assigned width.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Murray
>> >> ============
>> >>
>> >> "Nathan" <Nathan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:0F3CD67C-697F-40EC-9844-598FFCE991FA@microsoft.com...
>> >> > I've a bit of a dilemma. I originally had my site setup using tables
>> >> > for
>> >> > design purposes. It worked fine, but reading online more and more
>> >> > about
>> >> > CSS
>> >> > standards relating to FF and IE and especially with IE7 on it's way,
>> >> > I
>> >> > felt
>> >> > it appropriate to eliminate much of the tables (except for listed
>> >> > data)
>> >> > and
>> >> > deal with CSS.
>> >> >
>> >> > Well, dealing I've done, but as it has been claimed that CSS can do
>> >> > anything
>> >> > Tables can, I think I have to beg to differ and hope someone can
>> >> > prove
>> >> > me
>> >> > wrong. :)
>> >> >
>> >> > Problem:
>> >> > 760px container centered in page with 100% height. No problem.
>> >> > 3 DIV children inside container as rows (header, menu, body).
>> >> > In the body, I may have a table dynamically listing data with
>> >> > unknown
>> >> > cell
>> >> > widths and nowrap used and desired.
>> >> >
>> >> > Let's say that table expands to 900px for whatever reason. I would
>> >> > like
>> >> > the
>> >> > container to expand (which it does), but so too the other children
>> >> > DIVs
>> >> > (which don't). It was my expectation that all children DIVs without
>> >> > any
>> >> > specified CSS tags (such as float or width...) would fill the
>> >> > container
>> >> > wide-ways.
>> >> >
>> >> > I've seen a lot of liquid CSS designs out there with columns
>> >> > expanding
>> >> > and
>> >> > contracting based on %, but I haven't been able to see anything like
>> >> > this.
>> >> >
>> >> > Any ideas/suggestions/comments/solutions/questions/(etc...)?
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks,
>> >> > Nathan
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>