Option gone: "After sending, move to ..."

Version: 2008
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
Processor: Intel
Email Client: pop

Does anyone have ANY idea why the braintrust at Microsoft decided to eliminate the feature that allows you to save a message you are about to send to a specific folder after you send it? I just loaded the 2008 product, and am sitting here in stunned disbelief that this feature has been removed from Entourage. I mean, seriously, WTF? This is beyond astonishing. This is a standard feature in MS Outlook, and I use it heavily on my Windows machine, and until a few minutes ago, always on my MacBook with Entourage. How could this happen? How could the programmers upgrading Entourage decide that this function was expendable, whereas its equivalent in Outlook continues to be a standard feature?

Now every time we send a message, we must copy it to Sent Messages, then go into Sent Messages and move it from there to the appropriate folder. What a supreme waste of time.

I want to cry. This is SUCH a letdown.

Barry
Sun Jul 20 01:52:36 CDT 2008

In article <59b54a91.-1@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw>,
podbay@officeformac.com wrote:

> Version: 2008
> Operating System: Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard)
> Processor: Intel
> Email Client: pop
>
> Does anyone have ANY idea why the braintrust at Microsoft decided to
> eliminate the feature that allows you to save a message you are about to send
> to a specific folder after you send it? I just loaded the 2008 product, and
> am sitting here in stunned disbelief that this feature has been removed from
> Entourage. I mean, seriously, WTF? This is beyond astonishing. This is a
> standard feature in MS Outlook, and I use it heavily on my Windows machine,
> and until a few minutes ago, always on my MacBook with Entourage. How could
> this happen? How could the programmers upgrading Entourage decide that this
> function was expendable, whereas its equivalent in Outlook continues to be a
> standard feature?
>
> Now every time we send a message, we must copy it to Sent Messages, then go
> into Sent Messages and move it from there to the appropriate folder. What a
> supreme waste of time.
>
> I want to cry. This is SUCH a letdown.

It's still there. Bottom of the 'Message' menu when you have a draft
message window open for editing.

With the new interface changes, a few commands and functions have moved
around - it's worth spending a few minutes getting familiar with
everything.

--
Barry Wainwright
Microsoft MVP

William
Sun Jul 20 10:31:35 CDT 2008

Barry Wainwright wrote:

>> Does anyone have ANY idea why the braintrust at Microsoft decided to
>> eliminate the feature that allows you to save a message you are about to send
>> to a specific folder after you send it? I just loaded the 2008 product, and
>> am sitting here in stunned disbelief that this feature has been removed from
>> Entourage. I mean, seriously, WTF? This is beyond astonishing. This is a
>> standard feature in MS Outlook, and I use it heavily on my Windows machine,
>> and until a few minutes ago, always on my MacBook with Entourage. How could
>> this happen? How could the programmers upgrading Entourage decide that this
>> function was expendable, whereas its equivalent in Outlook continues to be a
>> standard feature?

> It's still there. Bottom of the 'Message' menu when you have a draft
> message window open for editing.
>
> With the new interface changes, a few commands and functions have moved
> around - it's worth spending a few minutes getting familiar with
> everything.

Adding to Barry's comment... Only the menu button has disappeared; the
command has moved to a different menu as he's already said.

Please be sure to let Microsoft know you'd like to see the menu button
return in future versions by using the Help --> Send Feedback mechanism
in any Office application.

--

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>
YouTalk <http://nine.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/youtalk>

podbay
Sun Jul 20 16:37:42 CDT 2008

Barry and Bill: Thank you both for your responses. Barry, I did find these options in the Message Menu, thank you for directing me to that menu. Bill, I did send feedback via the Help->Send Feedback mechanism, asking that the Menu Button for Options be returned to the Toolbar.

My reaction, emotional as it may seem, is because I can't wrap my mind around why this basic function would be removed to a drop-down menu. I can't fathom how such a decision might have been reached by the Mac/Office senior staff, as if this was something not used or not valued by Mac Office users, and yet in MS Office Outlook, it's standard and basic.

Again, thanks for responding to my query/rant.

Kind regards,
Randy (podbay)

Jolly
Sun Jul 20 17:25:05 CDT 2008

In article <59b54a91.2@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw>,
podbay@officeformac.com wrote:

> My reaction, emotional as it may seem, is because I can't wrap my mind around
> why this basic function would be removed to a drop-down menu. I can't fathom
> how such a decision might have been reached by the Mac/Office senior staff,
> as if this was something not used or not valued by Mac Office users, and yet
> in MS Office Outlook, it's standard and basic.

The obvious answer would be that rather than them having *removed* a
bunch of features, they did a complete rewrite of this part of the
application (or the entire application), and simply didn't have enough
time to *implement* the feature before release. I have no direct proof
that this is the case, but it certainly would explain why so many
features we relied on in 2004 are simply missing in 2008. If I am
correct (well either way, really), let's just hope Microsoft sees fit to
add the plethora of missing features back in a future update!

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than to me, as
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

Barry
Mon Jul 21 01:33:00 CDT 2008

In article <59b54a91.2@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw>,
podbay@officeformac.com wrote:

> My reaction, emotional as it may seem, is because I can't wrap my mind around
> why this basic function would be removed to a drop-down menu. I can't fathom
> how such a decision might have been reached by the Mac/Office senior staff,
> as if this was something not used or not valued by Mac Office users, and yet
> in MS Office Outlook, it's standard and basic.

it's always been in the menu, what has been lost is the toolbar button.

Toolbars got a major workout in this release and I guess they had to
prioritise on what their feedback suggested was most important to the
majority of users. Personally I almost never use that option (in either
entourage or outlook). Different people use the apps in different ways -
your 'must have' feature is not the same as everyone elses, and
vice-versa.

(but, it' good to blow off steam once in a while :)

--
Barry Wainwright
Microsoft MVP

Jolly
Mon Jul 21 09:22:21 CDT 2008

In article <barry-893184.07330021072008@news.microsoft.com>,
Barry Wainwright <barry@mvps.org.INVALID> wrote:

> In article <59b54a91.2@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw>,
> podbay@officeformac.com wrote:
>
> > My reaction, emotional as it may seem, is because I can't wrap my mind
> > around
> > why this basic function would be removed to a drop-down menu. I can't
> > fathom
> > how such a decision might have been reached by the Mac/Office senior staff,
> > as if this was something not used or not valued by Mac Office users, and
> > yet
> > in MS Office Outlook, it's standard and basic.
>
> it's always been in the menu, what has been lost is the toolbar button.
>
> Toolbars got a major workout in this release and I guess they had to
> prioritise on what their feedback suggested was most important to the
> majority of users. Personally I almost never use that option (in either
> entourage or outlook). Different people use the apps in different ways -
> your 'must have' feature is not the same as everyone elses, and
> vice-versa.
>
> (but, it' good to blow off steam once in a while :)

For the record, I (still) use that feature a *LOT*. Missing features
like this and Microsoft's inexcusable drop of Palm synchronization
support is what keeps me using Office 2004. For the most part, 2008 is
wasted disk space for me.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than to me, as
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

podbay
Fri Aug 15 10:04:22 CDT 2008

I did find a "Move To" button when I tried to customize my toolbar, so have moved added that button accordingly.

I agree with JR's frustration. The other feature still missing from Entourage is the ability to add a hyperlink to a message, unless you have that "Applelinks" tab which allows one to use the "Make Hyperlinks X" function. I had no idea about this until someone told me about it in a previous message after I inquired about it a year ago.

So my question to Barry and Bill would be: why is this option, i.e., to add a hyperlink to a message in HTML in Entourage, not offered as a simple command? In Outlook, one highlights text and clicks on the Hyperlinks button. Again to me, this is such a no-brainer that I was beyond stunned when I saw that it wasn't an option in Entourage. If I was looking to advise on changes to the next upgrade, this option would be on the top of my wishlist.

- podbay

William
Fri Aug 15 20:03:25 CDT 2008

podbay@officeformac.com wrote:

> So my question to Barry and Bill would be: why is this option, i.e.,
> to add a hyperlink to a message in HTML in Entourage, not offered as
> a simple command? In Outlook, one highlights text and clicks on the
> Hyperlinks button. Again to me, this is such a no-brainer that I was
> beyond stunned when I saw that it wasn't an option in Entourage. If I
> was looking to advise on changes to the next upgrade, this option
> would be on the top of my wishlist.

Neither Barry nor I work for Microsoft. We are simply volunteers here.
We can't tell you what is behind Microsoft's thinking.

Allowing the author to insert a hyperlink is kind of a misnomer. The
receiving E-mail client will make links clickable, not the sending
E-mail client. So long as you precede a web address with "http://" or
something similar then your recipient will be able to click the link
even though you can't do so while you're composing the message.

Embedding hyperlinks in words or pictures is not supported in Entourage
because *complex* HTML is not supported. Entourage supports *simple*
HTML, which is akin to Outlook's Rich Text Format.

So, why doesn't Microsoft include complex HTML in Entourage? That can
only be answered by Microsoft. I'd say it simply hasn't been a priority
compared to other features they thought their customers needed more.

--

bill

Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>
YouTalk <http://nine.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/youtalk>
Twitter: follow <http://twitter.com/meck>

Diane
Fri Aug 15 21:16:51 CDT 2008

"William Smith [MVP]" wrote:

> So, why doesn't Microsoft include complex HTML in Entourage? That can
> only be answered by Microsoft. I'd say it simply hasn't been a priority
> compared to other features they thought their customers needed more.

If they add it, some security update will probably break it. :-)

Just think you can hide the URL behind words....what better way to spam you?

--
Diane

podbay
Sun Aug 17 19:54:40 CDT 2008

Thanks again for these responses. I wasn't aware that each of you is not a Microsoft employee; for some reason I thought you were. Nonetheless, I really appreciate that you take time to address my concerns. I wasn't aware that Entourage supports simply HTML only, which explains why it can't offer the embedding of links over text in messages. I'll live with it for now.

Thanks again, everyone.