Firewire for Windbg. brand important?

Hi all,

the machine i bought for debugging drivers does not have firewire, and i'd
like to add a PCI board with firewire ports.

are there boards that are known not to work for debugging? or doesn't it
matter what brand of board I buy?

kind regards,
Bruno.

Mark
Sun May 29 09:52:28 CDT 2005

Bruno van Dooren wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> the machine i bought for debugging drivers does not have firewire, and i'd
> like to add a PCI board with firewire ports.
>
> are there boards that are known not to work for debugging? or doesn't it
> matter what brand of board I buy?
>
> kind regards,
> Bruno.
>
>
Theoretically any controller that uses the standard inbox drivers ought
to work just fine. I'm using the widely available and sold under many
retail labels combo usb2.0/1394 pci card (the retail label was 'beltran'
but they are not the manufacturer) and it is working just fine. After
some intitial hiccups getting it configured just right, the thought of
going back to serial ports is too painful to contemplate. (Hint: disable
the 1394 network adapter on your development machine side.)

Hopefully a USB debug port will appear in the relative near future as
well, although as 1394 is becoming as common as USB, this is becoming
less interesting.

Perhaps by 2010 all excuses for the legacy crap on the PC platform can
be ignored?

--

=====================
Mark Roddy DDK MVP
Windows 2003/XP/2000 Consulting
Hollis Technology Solutions 603-321-1032
www.hollistech.com

Bruno
Sun May 29 10:43:25 CDT 2005

> Perhaps by 2010 all excuses for the legacy crap on the PC platform can be
> ignored?
that would indeed be great. maybe by that time we have also done away with
interrupt sharing. ps2 and the south bridge.

i don't think USB will be possible because the USB standard does not foresee
2 masters on 1 bus. i even think it is electrically impossible.
USB is also a lot les powerfull in what it can do. it is basically an rs232
bus on steroids. firewire allows multiple masters etc.

the USB design guide is 2 cm thick. the firewire design guide about 7.

Don
Sun May 29 11:11:45 CDT 2005

Bruno,

They implement a smart cable. It has two devices (one for each system)
that talk to one another. This has been demo'd for several years, but
getting things stable (both software and hardware) can take time.


--
Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
Remove StopSpam from the email to reply



"Bruno van Dooren" <bruno_nos_pam_van_dooren@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:%23ppFmUGZFHA.1092@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
>> Perhaps by 2010 all excuses for the legacy crap on the PC platform can be
>> ignored?
> that would indeed be great. maybe by that time we have also done away with
> interrupt sharing. ps2 and the south bridge.
>
> i don't think USB will be possible because the USB standard does not
> foresee 2 masters on 1 bus. i even think it is electrically impossible.
> USB is also a lot les powerfull in what it can do. it is basically an
> rs232 bus on steroids. firewire allows multiple masters etc.
>
> the USB design guide is 2 cm thick. the firewire design guide about 7.
>

pavel_a
Sun May 29 12:38:02 CDT 2005

"Bruno van Dooren" wrote:
> i don't think USB will be possible because the USB standard does not foresee
> 2 masters on 1 bus. i even think it is electrically impossible.

The ECHI controller has special mode for kernel debugger.

No speculations... just the Intel EHCI spec., appendix C
http://www.intel.com/technology/usb/download/ehci-r10.pdf

Regards,
--PA

Maxim
Sun May 29 14:52:49 CDT 2005

> the USB design guide is 2 cm thick. the firewire design guide about 7.

The specs are 150 pages and 650 pages IIRC.

--
Maxim Shatskih, Windows DDK MVP
StorageCraft Corporation
maxim@storagecraft.com
http://www.storagecraft.com

Maxim
Sun May 29 14:53:29 CDT 2005

OHCI controller compatibility is a good idea. So, the best cards are the
ones with TSB12LV2x on the chip with Texas Instruments logo.

--
Maxim Shatskih, Windows DDK MVP
StorageCraft Corporation
maxim@storagecraft.com
http://www.storagecraft.com

"Bruno van Dooren" <bruno_nos_pam_van_dooren@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ek0jkb8YFHA.980@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Hi all,
>
> the machine i bought for debugging drivers does not have firewire, and i'd
> like to add a PCI board with firewire ports.
>
> are there boards that are known not to work for debugging? or doesn't it
> matter what brand of board I buy?
>
> kind regards,
> Bruno.
>
>

Bruno
Sun May 29 15:15:46 CDT 2005

:)

that corresponds reasonably well to the thickness in cm that i gave, give or
take half a cm or so.


"Maxim S. Shatskih" <maxim@storagecraft.com> wrote in message
news:ekiwsfIZFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>> the USB design guide is 2 cm thick. the firewire design guide about 7.
>
> The specs are 150 pages and 650 pages IIRC.
>
> --
> Maxim Shatskih, Windows DDK MVP
> StorageCraft Corporation
> maxim@storagecraft.com
> http://www.storagecraft.com
>
>

Bruno
Sun May 29 15:16:59 CDT 2005

i see. nice enough idea i guess, but a lot more complex (and expensive i
guess) than a firewire cable.

kind regards,
Bruno

"Don Burn" <burn@stopspam.acm.org> wrote in message
news:5Rlme.2401$dN6.394@fe03.lga...
> Bruno,
>
> They implement a smart cable. It has two devices (one for each
> system) that talk to one another. This has been demo'd for several years,
> but getting things stable (both software and hardware) can take time.
>
>
> --
> Don Burn (MVP, Windows DDK)
> Windows 2k/XP/2k3 Filesystem and Driver Consulting
> Remove StopSpam from the email to reply
>
>
>
> "Bruno van Dooren" <bruno_nos_pam_van_dooren@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:%23ppFmUGZFHA.1092@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
>>> Perhaps by 2010 all excuses for the legacy crap on the PC platform can
>>> be ignored?
>> that would indeed be great. maybe by that time we have also done away
>> with interrupt sharing. ps2 and the south bridge.
>>
>> i don't think USB will be possible because the USB standard does not
>> foresee 2 masters on 1 bus. i even think it is electrically impossible.
>> USB is also a lot les powerfull in what it can do. it is basically an
>> rs232 bus on steroids. firewire allows multiple masters etc.
>>
>> the USB design guide is 2 cm thick. the firewire design guide about 7.
>>
>
>