Why MS CRM?

Hi everyone,

Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
talking to several companies and each one
is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
that the pervasive backend is far superior then
SQL.

What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the layout.
Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
instead of having to double click on that account, then
double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
like the MS CRM solution.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Sincerely,

Scott Robinson.

John
Mon Jan 26 09:56:32 CST 2004

At my last company we were using goldmine. Everyone found the MS CRM
interface far easier to navigate. I agree with your statement about having
to naviate through multiple screens to see all info for an account etc. This
is basically a 360 degree view of the customer. Microsoft are aware of this
point so expect to see it on a later release but what to do in the meantime?

One of MS CRM's strengths is that it is built on the .NET development
platform. Put simply if you have developers on staff it is a straightforward
process to create addons to the CRM tool. This of course means if there is a
feature you cannot do without its possible you can write it yourself.

Not every CRM allows that level of flexiblity.

Lastly I would question any company that says Pervasive SQL is better than
MS SQL. I would ask them to qualify that statement.

Lastly cost - like everything else MS CRM has a price attached to it. If
your company will not or cannot afford the cost then of course you have to
look at alternative solutions. Look at Microsoft Business Contact manager
for a low cost CRM for example but keep in mind data cannot be shared
between users.





"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> talking to several companies and each one
> is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> SQL.
>
> What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
layout.
> Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> instead of having to double click on that account, then
> double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> like the MS CRM solution.
>
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Scott Robinson.
>
>

microsoft
Mon Jan 26 10:30:20 CST 2004

Thanks for the response Jerry. If MS does address this issue and others
(not just my peers)
believe this to be a problem then this my ease our mind as to what solution
we choose.

Another issue we don't like is the fact that entering data in named fields
is not case sensitive
and I must rely on my sales and service staff to enter information properly.
Maximizer Enterprise
will automatically captialize first and last names which is a nice simple
feature. Is anything like
this available from Microsoft yet?

What other small issues like this are going to be addressed? Is there a
working database of
issues people would like to see fixed?

Here is some information regarding maximizer enterprise 8 in case you are
curious, the price
is great and it even comes with crystal reports.
http://www.maximizerconsultants.com/me8info.html

This decision is going to kill me.

Scott

"John O'Donnell" <csharpconsulting@nospam-hotmail.com-nospam> wrote in
message news:eE0%234TC5DHA.3896@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
> At my last company we were using goldmine. Everyone found the MS CRM
> interface far easier to navigate. I agree with your statement about having
> to naviate through multiple screens to see all info for an account etc.
This
> is basically a 360 degree view of the customer. Microsoft are aware of
this
> point so expect to see it on a later release but what to do in the
meantime?
>
> One of MS CRM's strengths is that it is built on the .NET development
> platform. Put simply if you have developers on staff it is a
straightforward
> process to create addons to the CRM tool. This of course means if there is
a
> feature you cannot do without its possible you can write it yourself.
>
> Not every CRM allows that level of flexiblity.
>
> Lastly I would question any company that says Pervasive SQL is better than
> MS SQL. I would ask them to qualify that statement.
>
> Lastly cost - like everything else MS CRM has a price attached to it. If
> your company will not or cannot afford the cost then of course you have to
> look at alternative solutions. Look at Microsoft Business Contact manager
> for a low cost CRM for example but keep in mind data cannot be shared
> between users.
>
>
>
>
>
> "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > talking to several companies and each one
> > is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > SQL.
> >
> > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> layout.
> > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> > like the MS CRM solution.
> >
> > Any help would be much appreciated.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Scott Robinson.
> >
> >
>
>

John
Mon Jan 26 10:50:15 CST 2004

Hi Scott:

Please contact me directly at jstraumann@cogeco.ca for more info...

John.

"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> talking to several companies and each one
> is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> SQL.
>
> What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
layout.
> Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> instead of having to double click on that account, then
> double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> like the MS CRM solution.
>
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Scott Robinson.
>
>

John
Mon Jan 26 10:49:14 CST 2004

If you have access to MBS Partnersource then you can post suggestions to the
product team. You can also send suggestions to this group as Microsoft does
monitor the newsgroup.

On future releases I will expect to see things like the ability to have more
control over data entry with phone numbers in a consistent format etc.
Perhaps also duplicate checking.




"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:OBgtzmC5DHA.1804@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Thanks for the response Jerry. If MS does address this issue and others
> (not just my peers)
> believe this to be a problem then this my ease our mind as to what
solution
> we choose.
>
> Another issue we don't like is the fact that entering data in named fields
> is not case sensitive
> and I must rely on my sales and service staff to enter information
properly.
> Maximizer Enterprise
> will automatically captialize first and last names which is a nice simple
> feature. Is anything like
> this available from Microsoft yet?
>
> What other small issues like this are going to be addressed? Is there a
> working database of
> issues people would like to see fixed?
>
> Here is some information regarding maximizer enterprise 8 in case you are
> curious, the price
> is great and it even comes with crystal reports.
> http://www.maximizerconsultants.com/me8info.html
>
> This decision is going to kill me.
>
> Scott
>
> "John O'Donnell" <csharpconsulting@nospam-hotmail.com-nospam> wrote in
> message news:eE0%234TC5DHA.3896@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
> > At my last company we were using goldmine. Everyone found the MS CRM
> > interface far easier to navigate. I agree with your statement about
having
> > to naviate through multiple screens to see all info for an account etc.
> This
> > is basically a 360 degree view of the customer. Microsoft are aware of
> this
> > point so expect to see it on a later release but what to do in the
> meantime?
> >
> > One of MS CRM's strengths is that it is built on the .NET development
> > platform. Put simply if you have developers on staff it is a
> straightforward
> > process to create addons to the CRM tool. This of course means if there
is
> a
> > feature you cannot do without its possible you can write it yourself.
> >
> > Not every CRM allows that level of flexiblity.
> >
> > Lastly I would question any company that says Pervasive SQL is better
than
> > MS SQL. I would ask them to qualify that statement.
> >
> > Lastly cost - like everything else MS CRM has a price attached to it. If
> > your company will not or cannot afford the cost then of course you have
to
> > look at alternative solutions. Look at Microsoft Business Contact
manager
> > for a low cost CRM for example but keep in mind data cannot be shared
> > between users.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> > news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > > talking to several companies and each one
> > > is of course interested in selling us there own different software.
One
> > > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even
say
> > > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > > SQL.
> > >
> > > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> > layout.
> > > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > > which you can see all information for a particular account on one
screen
> > > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts
notes
> > > like the MS CRM solution.
> > >
> > > Any help would be much appreciated.
> > >
> > > Sincerely,
> > >
> > > Scott Robinson.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

Jake
Mon Jan 26 11:19:58 CST 2004

A few things I would think about.

The CRM market is going to be hyper-competitive in the next few years. If
you do a little comparison of the CRM market of today to the ERP market of
the mid 90s you will see a lot of similarities. There are still a lot of
players out there. What I would predict in the next few years, as growth
starts to sustain, is a consolidation of the market with a few remaining
players. The risk is implementing a solution from a vendor who will not
have a long term place in the market.

As well, do your due diligence. Have you been able to take a test drive of
the software. Not just a demo, controlled by the vendor, but an actual
hands on test drive. Many vendors can hide problems while showing demos of
the software.

I would reiterate the Pervasive SQL vs SQL Server question as well.

MS CRM 1.2 is not a perfect product. However, I do think MS has the track
record of perfecting their products over time. Can you see your
organization having to switch CRM vendors 5 years down the road due to a
company purchase, or lack of scalability?

These are all questions I would consider.

Jake

"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> talking to several companies and each one
> is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> SQL.
>
> What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
layout.
> Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> instead of having to double click on that account, then
> double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> like the MS CRM solution.
>
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Scott Robinson.
>
>

GreaterThanTwo
Mon Jan 26 12:45:34 CST 2004

Hi Scott, I think there have been several great replies to you questions, I
just wanted to add a little more:

- You may want to find an independant company that can help you evaluate
various CRM products based on you requirements.

- There are a few companies that make add-ons for MSCRM, such as the
relationship tree by GaleForce Solutions, that gives you a consolidated,
tree view of all data related to contact/account/order/etc.

- If you want simple things like field capitalization, companies like mine
can add that in for you fairly inexpensively.

- I'd also strongly question the SQL thing as well. Basically, MSCRM is
very well architected behind the scenes and there are many features that
aren't yet implemented in the interface. It's quite apparent that there is
still alot more value yet to come in this product.

Mike


"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> talking to several companies and each one
> is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> SQL.
>
> What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
layout.
> Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> instead of having to double click on that account, then
> double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> like the MS CRM solution.
>
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Scott Robinson.
>
>

Chuck
Mon Jan 26 17:40:34 CST 2004

We looked at Maximizer and bought MS CRM. Would NOT buy MS CRM again. We
would buy Salesforce today.

Chuck

"microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> talking to several companies and each one
> is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> SQL.
>
> What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
layout.
> Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> instead of having to double click on that account, then
> double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> like the MS CRM solution.
>
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Scott Robinson.
>
>

Jake
Mon Jan 26 18:39:26 CST 2004

Chuck,

Would you care to elaborate on the issues you are having? Sometimes issues
are alleviated when plugging in the right minds.

Jake

"Chuck Latham" <chuck_latham_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:O8YUOXG5DHA.2692@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> We looked at Maximizer and bought MS CRM. Would NOT buy MS CRM again.
We
> would buy Salesforce today.
>
> Chuck
>
> "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > talking to several companies and each one
> > is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > SQL.
> >
> > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> layout.
> > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> > like the MS CRM solution.
> >
> > Any help would be much appreciated.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Scott Robinson.
> >
> >
>
>

jwgildea
Tue Jan 27 11:48:07 CST 2004

Hope I'm not being too bold and presumptuous in complaining about this
response. This a forum for information sharing, not poaching for
business. Provide some good input and maybe some business will come
your way.

"John" <jstraumann@<nospam>cogeco.ca> wrote in message news:<u1GSywC5DHA.2572@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl>...
> Hi Scott:
>
> Please contact me directly at jstraumann@cogeco.ca for more info...
>
> John.

microsoft
Tue Jan 27 12:20:48 CST 2004

Chuck,

could you explain your reasoning so I can get a better understanding of why
you would
choose salesforce over MS CRM. Thanks

Scott


"Chuck Latham" <chuck_latham_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:O8YUOXG5DHA.2692@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> We looked at Maximizer and bought MS CRM. Would NOT buy MS CRM again.
We
> would buy Salesforce today.
>
> Chuck
>
> "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > talking to several companies and each one
> > is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > SQL.
> >
> > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> layout.
> > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> > like the MS CRM solution.
> >
> > Any help would be much appreciated.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Scott Robinson.
> >
> >
>
>

Walt
Wed Jan 28 14:44:36 CST 2004

Hello Scott.

This is an excellent question, one that I have been
pondering for several months myself. I'll give you my
take on this, but first a little background:
* I have been a custom database developer since 1987,
using various front end and back end products.
* I subscribe to the Microsoft Action Pack, and that's
where I first heard about CRM.
* Several of my clients need specific CRM-type functions
than my custom databases currently don't offer. To
develop these features one-on-one for those clients will
be time- and cost-prohibitive, so I decided to look at MS
CRM as a possible package that I could offer to clients.
This would give my clients (and me) the opportunity to
leverage off the gazillions of dollars that Microsoft
spends on research and development.

So far, so good.

In theory, Microsoft CRM is perfect: it is the most
extensible of the CRM products (because of the .NET
>-----Original Message-----
>Hi everyone,
>
>Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service.
We have been
>talking to several companies and each one
>is of course interested in selling us there own
different software. One
>particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
>but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better
option. They even say
>that the pervasive backend is far superior then
>SQL.
>
>What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose
MS CRM over the
>competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
>and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in
Accpacs CRM
>solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
>and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about
MS CRM is the layout.
>Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
>which you can see all information for a particular
account on one screen
>instead of having to double click on that account, then
>double click on the contact and then double click on
that contacts notes
>like the MS CRM solution.
>
>Any help would be much appreciated.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Scott Robinson.
>
>
>.
>

Walt
Wed Jan 28 15:05:37 CST 2004

Sorry about the cut-off message. I must have hit the
wrong button :(

To continue my train of thought:
In theory, leveraging off the billions of dollars of
Microsoft R&D money seems to be an ideal solution.
However, the problem with the current incarnation of CRM
is that it is a 1.X product, and it shows.
1) There are so many problems with configuration,
installation, compatibility, and so on, that the initial
installation costs to my clients will be far, far higher
than those of a custom solution.

2) There are so many missing features in the current
version that my clients will have to spend a small
fortune on all the customizations that it will take to
get the current CRM version usable in their environment.
They need multiple email addresses, joint use of contacts
when in CRM and the local Outlook client, Customization
of Activity field displays, a simpler way to add
calculated fields, a way to add pick lists that get their
source data from the database, the ability to change the
name of the Organization with a complete re-migration of
data, etc., etc., etc.

All of these things are either impossible, or will incur
significant costs, in the current incarnation of
Microsoft CRM. So net-net, it does not appear that my
clients will save much money by implementing the current
version of CRM.

However, for the long term, Microsoft CRM is a no-brainer
decision. As others have pointed out, the CRM market is
due for a shake-out and many vendors will not survive.
But Microsoft has an excellent track record of taking a
product and sticking with it until it is an excellent
value for the money. (Does anyone out there remember the
jokes about Windows: how do you turn a 486 into a 386...)

So for me, Microsoft CRM is the correct decision;
however, I am advising my clients to either
1) install now and live with the fact that several dozen
desired features are missing (unless they want to pay for
dozens of specific customizations), or
2)wait at least a year, until the installation/
implementation issues are resolved, and the product has
more built-in features.

But in the meantime, I am learning all I can about this
product. My gut instinct tells me that it will be a big
winner in the long run.

Just my $0.02...

Walt

>-----Original Message-----
>Hello Scott.
>
>This is an excellent question, one that I have been
>pondering for several months myself. I'll give you my
>take on this, but first a little background:
>* I have been a custom database developer since 1987,
>using various front end and back end products.
>* I subscribe to the Microsoft Action Pack, and that's
>where I first heard about CRM.
>* Several of my clients need specific CRM-type functions
>than my custom databases currently don't offer. To
>develop these features one-on-one for those clients will
>be time- and cost-prohibitive, so I decided to look at
MS
>CRM as a possible package that I could offer to clients.
>This would give my clients (and me) the opportunity to
>leverage off the gazillions of dollars that Microsoft
>spends on research and development.
>
>So far, so good.
>
>In theory, Microsoft CRM is perfect: it is the most
>extensible of the CRM products (because of the .NET
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Hi everyone,
>>
>>Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and
service.
>We have been
>>talking to several companies and each one
>>is of course interested in selling us there own
>different software. One
>>particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
>>but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better
>option. They even say
>>that the pervasive backend is far superior then
>>SQL.
>>
>>What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose
>MS CRM over the
>>competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
>>and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in
>Accpacs CRM
>>solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
>>and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about
>MS CRM is the layout.
>>Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
>>which you can see all information for a particular
>account on one screen
>>instead of having to double click on that account, then
>>double click on the contact and then double click on
>that contacts notes
>>like the MS CRM solution.
>>
>>Any help would be much appreciated.
>>
>>Sincerely,
>>
>>Scott Robinson.
>>
>>
>>.
>>
>.
>

Jake
Wed Jan 28 19:52:56 CST 2004

Well said Walt.

Jake

"Walt Nelson" <anonymous@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:5fac01c3e5e2$7a5423d0$a001280a@phx.gbl...
> Sorry about the cut-off message. I must have hit the
> wrong button :(
>
> To continue my train of thought:
> In theory, leveraging off the billions of dollars of
> Microsoft R&D money seems to be an ideal solution.
> However, the problem with the current incarnation of CRM
> is that it is a 1.X product, and it shows.
> 1) There are so many problems with configuration,
> installation, compatibility, and so on, that the initial
> installation costs to my clients will be far, far higher
> than those of a custom solution.
>
> 2) There are so many missing features in the current
> version that my clients will have to spend a small
> fortune on all the customizations that it will take to
> get the current CRM version usable in their environment.
> They need multiple email addresses, joint use of contacts
> when in CRM and the local Outlook client, Customization
> of Activity field displays, a simpler way to add
> calculated fields, a way to add pick lists that get their
> source data from the database, the ability to change the
> name of the Organization with a complete re-migration of
> data, etc., etc., etc.
>
> All of these things are either impossible, or will incur
> significant costs, in the current incarnation of
> Microsoft CRM. So net-net, it does not appear that my
> clients will save much money by implementing the current
> version of CRM.
>
> However, for the long term, Microsoft CRM is a no-brainer
> decision. As others have pointed out, the CRM market is
> due for a shake-out and many vendors will not survive.
> But Microsoft has an excellent track record of taking a
> product and sticking with it until it is an excellent
> value for the money. (Does anyone out there remember the
> jokes about Windows: how do you turn a 486 into a 386...)
>
> So for me, Microsoft CRM is the correct decision;
> however, I am advising my clients to either
> 1) install now and live with the fact that several dozen
> desired features are missing (unless they want to pay for
> dozens of specific customizations), or
> 2)wait at least a year, until the installation/
> implementation issues are resolved, and the product has
> more built-in features.
>
> But in the meantime, I am learning all I can about this
> product. My gut instinct tells me that it will be a big
> winner in the long run.
>
> Just my $0.02...
>
> Walt
>
> >-----Original Message-----
> >Hello Scott.
> >
> >This is an excellent question, one that I have been
> >pondering for several months myself. I'll give you my
> >take on this, but first a little background:
> >* I have been a custom database developer since 1987,
> >using various front end and back end products.
> >* I subscribe to the Microsoft Action Pack, and that's
> >where I first heard about CRM.
> >* Several of my clients need specific CRM-type functions
> >than my custom databases currently don't offer. To
> >develop these features one-on-one for those clients will
> >be time- and cost-prohibitive, so I decided to look at
> MS
> >CRM as a possible package that I could offer to clients.
> >This would give my clients (and me) the opportunity to
> >leverage off the gazillions of dollars that Microsoft
> >spends on research and development.
> >
> >So far, so good.
> >
> >In theory, Microsoft CRM is perfect: it is the most
> >extensible of the CRM products (because of the .NET
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>Hi everyone,
> >>
> >>Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and
> service.
> >We have been
> >>talking to several companies and each one
> >>is of course interested in selling us there own
> >different software. One
> >>particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> >>but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better
> >option. They even say
> >>that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> >>SQL.
> >>
> >>What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose
> >MS CRM over the
> >>competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> >>and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in
> >Accpacs CRM
> >>solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> >>and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about
> >MS CRM is the layout.
> >>Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> >>which you can see all information for a particular
> >account on one screen
> >>instead of having to double click on that account, then
> >>double click on the contact and then double click on
> >that contacts notes
> >>like the MS CRM solution.
> >>
> >>Any help would be much appreciated.
> >>
> >>Sincerely,
> >>
> >>Scott Robinson.
> >>
> >>
> >>.
> >>
> >.
> >

Chuck
Sat Jan 31 16:56:41 CST 2004

1. Extremely slow and really can not use from a phone line. Our sales
people travel and can not always get a high speed line.

2. Great product for IT people but not a sales person friendly product. I
need salespeople to use the product.

3. Very difficult product to train on. We finally decided that you either
use Outlook CRM or the web client as many of the functions are different.
We are focusing on the Outlook client as that is what our salespeople use
daily.

4. Salesforce.com provides free online training.

5. IT people like servers, owners see overhead and more cost.

6. Very slow coompared to all other CRM packages.

I am not an IT person but the owner of a mid - sized business. .net does
not mean anything to me. I only care about the results. I wanted to
accomplish that our sales people spend more time in front of our customers
not in waiting for a screen to come up. I expected more from Microsoft.


"Chuck Latham" <chuck_latham_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:O8YUOXG5DHA.2692@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> We looked at Maximizer and bought MS CRM. Would NOT buy MS CRM again.
We
> would buy Salesforce today.
>
> Chuck
>
> "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > talking to several companies and each one
> > is of course interested in selling us there own different software. One
> > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even say
> > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > SQL.
> >
> > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> layout.
> > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > which you can see all information for a particular account on one screen
> > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts notes
> > like the MS CRM solution.
> >
> > Any help would be much appreciated.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Scott Robinson.
> >
> >
>
>

GreaterThanTwo
Thu Feb 05 14:44:22 CST 2004

1) Anything's slow over dial-up. MS CRM is fairly light weight...I doubt
any other web-based CRM app would be faster, plus, MSCRM has the Outlook
client which can be used offline by your sales people. Salesforce doesn't
offer that.

2) MSCRM is one of the easiest to use and consistently designed CRM
applications I've seen (FYI, I don't sell MSCRM). Once you learn the
basics, it's quite simple.

3) The functions are 99% the same between the Outlook client and the web
client...other than the Outlook integration features of course.

4) We haven't found a need to train most users on MSCRM. Most people have
found it very intuitive.

5) MSCRM is designed to scale for larger shops. It's not meant for single
user or just a few users. As with any Enterprise application, it requires
dedicated servers! You may want to look at the new Business Contact Manager
for Outlook.

6) If you think MSCRM is slow, then you have something wrong with your
setup. I run 3 CRM servers on a single p4 (using VMWare), and no screen in
the entire application takes more than a second to load. You may have DNS
problems, resource contention issues, or your using the CRM 1.0 Outlook
client, which is much slower than the CRM 1.0 web client, but is now fast in
CRM 1.2.

Chuck, I gather from your feedback that you aren't looking for an enterprise
level CRM software, and it sounds like the way you want to use CRM may not
be a good fit for the MS product. You do need to have the proper knowledge
and support in house or available to you to implement and maintain an
enterprise application effectively. If you're waiting for screens to come
up in MSCRM, then there are definately issues with your instalation.

Mike


"Chuck Latham" <chuck_latham_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ejZAB2E6DHA.2540@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
> 1. Extremely slow and really can not use from a phone line. Our sales
> people travel and can not always get a high speed line.
>
> 2. Great product for IT people but not a sales person friendly product. I
> need salespeople to use the product.
>
> 3. Very difficult product to train on. We finally decided that you either
> use Outlook CRM or the web client as many of the functions are different.
> We are focusing on the Outlook client as that is what our salespeople use
> daily.
>
> 4. Salesforce.com provides free online training.
>
> 5. IT people like servers, owners see overhead and more cost.
>
> 6. Very slow coompared to all other CRM packages.
>
> I am not an IT person but the owner of a mid - sized business. .net does
> not mean anything to me. I only care about the results. I wanted to
> accomplish that our sales people spend more time in front of our customers
> not in waiting for a screen to come up. I expected more from Microsoft.
>
>
> "Chuck Latham" <chuck_latham_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:O8YUOXG5DHA.2692@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > We looked at Maximizer and bought MS CRM. Would NOT buy MS CRM again.
> We
> > would buy Salesforce today.
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> > "microsoft.public.crm" <sales@sanitechinc.com> wrote in message
> > news:%231IID1B5DHA.2528@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Our SMB is in need of a CRM for both sales and service. We have been
> > > talking to several companies and each one
> > > is of course interested in selling us there own different software.
One
> > > particular companies is even a MS CRM distributor
> > > but feels that Maximizer enterprise 8 is a better option. They even
say
> > > that the pervasive backend is far superior then
> > > SQL.
> > >
> > > What were the deciding factors that lead you to choose MS CRM over the
> > > competition. We are looking at Maximizer Enterprise 8,
> > > and MS CRM Sales and Service Pro, with some interest in Accpacs CRM
> > > solution. We currently only run a peer to peer network
> > > and cost is somewhat of an issue. Our main grip about MS CRM is the
> > layout.
> > > Maximizer enterprise 8 has a great layout in
> > > which you can see all information for a particular account on one
screen
> > > instead of having to double click on that account, then
> > > double click on the contact and then double click on that contacts
notes
> > > like the MS CRM solution.
> > >
> > > Any help would be much appreciated.
> > >
> > > Sincerely,
> > >
> > > Scott Robinson.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>